Grr, the puppy craving...

Discussion in 'Puppies' started by tx_cowgirl, Aug 23, 2010.

  1. reveuse Well-Known Member

    Total COINCIDENCE but I think Ro must have read the posts you both made about breakthrough ordinary moments, dancing up and down, and all of the super happy type things! Because he decided to give me a handful of them this evening. (granted they were peppered with a few minor barking instants in between)

    Decided to take him to a group intermediate class for some heeling practice (which we basically never got around to) and to see how long we could last in a class setting without putting the GL on him at all. (I put it on him for about 30 seconds at the 10 min mark of class and then it wasn't needed again til the very end an hour later - but that is actually only the beginning of the happy story :dogsmile:

    Somehow , as often is the case when I intend to practice something totally opposite (ie nice walking and zero feeding), Romeo's aisle of choice (with all the beds of course!) it wound up being a nonstop sea of target practice time.
    about 3/4 of the way through a guy comes right over to where we are (at the start of the aisle and on the right side) and stands at the left side of the same aisle (so literally about a foot and a half or so away) and says: " Oh is that a morkie? He's very cute." to which I replied (while giving romeo more treats in a 30 second span than I had in the past 45 min) something to the extent of " Thank you , he might be cute but he most likely wants to try to bite you. He does NOT like men "... Despite my warning the guy decides to sit down on the corner of the display on his side of my aisle!!!!!! ummmmm Death Wish!?!
    after having issued multiple warnings (i wasn't going to do a removal since he wasn't reacting and I had everything under control) about the possibilty that my dog might be cujo and not a cute fluffy thing I decided to take the opportunity as it was presenting itself willingly/stupidly , and handed the man some nice tasty non dinner snacks for him to toss at Ro , after about four of them my monster was literally eating out of the dudes hand. And accepting various amounts of petting and being talked to ............:doghuh::dogohmy::dogunsure::dogbiggrin: ............ no leader on, not chicken but still a semi decent type treat, complete strange man. = I couldnt decide if I should faint or jump up and down or what on earth to do ------- LOTS AND LOTS of "good dog" "good boy" "jackpot"

    Even trainer was in like :confused: dying of shock and amazement mode....

    Of course two min later three guys walk down from the opposite end of the aisle and park themselves in the middle of it for a good 10 min or so......... He looked , but did not growl. click treat. look no growl . click treat........ rinse and repeat , the whole time. Even as one of them walked past us and past us again a few min after that......


    There were a few other sprinklings of man somewhere in there but those were the real super biggys........
    Of course when we went into the class room at the end he wanted to go postal at one of the other dogs male owner and on went the GL.. but the instant i put it on him he was like o.o " sorry mom i'll go back to behaving" ...
    srdogtrainer, tigerlily46514 and Jean like this.

  2. reveuse Well-Known Member

    oh as one more aside to Tigerlily I TOTALLY caught myself commenting to Ro on the weather today as well as asking him if he had a nice day at camp as we walked out of the store and thought of your post :)
    tigerlily46514 likes this.
  3. tigerlily46514 Honored Member

    OH SAMANTHA!!! HUGE KUDOS TO YOU AND RO FOR BREAKTHROUGH!!!!! WOOHOO!!! HIVE FIVES ALL AROUND!!! Wow, doncha LOVE moments like that, and feel like you and Ro are making such good progress????????? wow, 4 guys in a row, and Ro was cool??????? YOU ARE GETTING THERE!!! YAY!!!

    (Whenever i feel that way, next day, Buddy tends to do something to make me sorry i bragged...ha ha! i think he reads my posts...)
    srdogtrainer likes this.
  4. reveuse Well-Known Member

    This morning we had another 3 amazing man, man, and a golf cart with man encounters on our morning mini trip downstairs ........ (one of which he went to lunge and i said leave it and he just sat and froze (called him off in mid stalk! hahaha) ...

    this afternoon tho he almost made me regret bragging by going postal in the store for a good ten min span (of really high target level activity) til i could get his leader on him .... and then he shushed LOL

    I SWEAR they definetly read posts.....totally!
    tigerlily46514 likes this.
  5. tigerlily46514 Honored Member

    yeah they do!!! For sure!! SOON as they think we are getting all proud or whatever, well, then, they must see it as their job to take us back down a notch??!!!!

    Buddy went to this petstore, and there is indoor lobby, just outside the store...........

    one of the places i use to work on Buddy's dog aggression. He can see a dog in a cage in the window. We start far away, calming signals, treats, massage, hang good.

    then we move closer, calming signals, treats for looking at the monsterdog, massage, hang around. People go by and pet him, he loves that part, actually forgets about monsterdog as he meets all the ppl. Occasionally, he will even do a trick or two for them.

    Move closer, and so on.

    then we go IN the petstore, (they all know Buddy, "Ey, he IS getting better!! Not even a bark!?") but we do not go close to caged dog, but, at times, inside the store Buddy can see the dog, and we do it again....Monsterdog barked his head off (i felt so bad for him) and Buddy stayed cool. SHOCK AND AWE!!! I should mark this on the calendar.

    so yesterday, not one bark!! Not only was he calm, i do believe he was so enjoying himself!!! He was smiling, and loving all the att'n from passersby and the store clerks.............he LOVES ppl now...JUST LOVES 'EM...and didn't jump up on anyone, sat nicely and smiled at anyone who spoke to him, he just was perfect lil gentlemen. I do think he forgot about monsterdog over there in the cage.

    we did some focus work next to the gerbil cages...Buddy loooves those gerbils, very hard to not stare at them.

    AND when we went outside, doncha know, was a car parked right at the curb with 3 chihuahuas in it, alll 3 screamed when they saw Buddy, all 3 lil dogs started doing laps inside the car, barking and hollering,
    AND...............wait for it........Buddy just walked down the sidewalk, and didn't say a word!! THUD as i hit the cement..

    so tomorrow, ---since i bragged right now-----------Buddy will SOo act up cuz he is reading this right now, over my shoulder, probably making his mental plan to do some 4star Cujo action ....tomorrow...
    reveuse likes this.
  6. reveuse Well-Known Member

    WAY TO GO BUDDY! Romeo and I are both VERY VERY proud of the supremely good brave doggie behavior you had today !

    Those monsterdogs are tough work but ignoring three superfierce chis is even cooler!
    Did you ninja the gerbils?[IMG] , Buddy try to remember they are NOT a tasty snack (as a dog that sometimes resembles a squirrel I don't think Ro wants to be considered food! hahaha)

    Maybe their synchronized good behavior has something to do with the moon ?!?!
    Mine has been known to literally paw at my touchpad when I get up from my spot and sit staring at the screen. - I suspect he goes on Facebook when I'm out....

    Tomorrow mine won't have a chance to be Cujo - he will be at camp all day and then my friend is going to bring him home as I'm making a day trip to Disney til late evening.

    SUNDAY he better not misbehave since its his Birthday day...... ----- Tricks class, A private lesson, a playdate with his girlfriend (my neighbors yellow lab (seriously!)

    tigerlily46514 likes this.
  7. tigerlily46514 Honored Member

    rofl!! TOO FUNNY!!! Sounds like A GREAT WEEKEND!!! HOPE IT ALL GOES SUPER SMOOTH!!! (it IS a very full moon tonight, [IMG]ha ha, i just got in from taking Buddy on we call "The Last Whiz"--last walk of the night.)

  8. tx_cowgirl Honored Member

    CONGRATS and happy b-day to Romeo!
    Ugh, response to the guy who didn't listen to you...people SUCK. Lol, even though this one turned out to be good.
    When I worked at Petsmart, I took a class with our trainer who was AWESOME. One night, we were working on heel and I was heeling off-leash down an aisle. It was a night class, so the janitors were about. I understand they have a job to do, but my gosh....
    He had the floor buffer going, and came right down my aisle--it takes up the WHOLE aisle. He saw me and Zeke and just kept coming! Well it's loud, for one, and a strange man is pushing it. Z was not happy. He was a shaky velcro dog the rest of the night. Grr. He could've gone down another aisle for the next one or two minutes that we were going to heel on that particular aisle.

    As for breakthroughs, about 7 or so months ago I had Z at my current job(off the clock). I didn't have his Gentle Leader on, but I did have his tennis ball. One of my coworkers is a VERY tall man, with a VERY VERY deep voice. So you would think...Z is going to be absolutely terrified of this guy. Turned out being the FIRST stranger that Z has ever approached completely on his own, with no tennis ball. I wasn't even encouraging him! I was just having a conversation and told him that Z was really shy, not to pet him--just to let him come to him. I had dropped Z's leash and he was just chilling out with me, when all of a sudden he walks right up to this guy and sniffs his hand. And then he let him pet him! All over! When he was done, he came back to me like, "PHEW! Didn't think I could do that."

    We played for a little while in the store, he got lots of tennis ball time, and then we went home and I jumped up and down and gave him a giant hug, lol!

    BIG CONGRATS to you and Romeo! :)
    reveuse likes this.
  9. tigerlily46514 Honored Member

    TX, i ALWAYS chuckle out loud about that Zekers!! too cute!! What a buncha characters!! Maybe even Zeke has his own lil stripe of "randomness" like Buddy and Romeo do?!!! Who would have thought that Zekers would go up and approach a great big guy with a big voice?? Go figure....
  10. tigerlily46514 Honored Member

    oh, btw, kinda random and out of order, but, earlier up, Samantha mentioned she thought of this thread, remembering how i said, sometimes to show Buddy i am not afraid, i speak out loud so he can hear me being happy and calm, well, i meant to say, i do talk to the other human, holding the leash of monsterdog.
    I do, ha ha, probably all my neighbors think i am chattiest, most outgoing gal in town, but, i talk to them. Buddy has certainly learned the cadence of normal human talking, so i do it, for the chance it might reduce his fears, aobut monster dog, if he sees *I* am not worried. Doesn't always help, but, always worth a try.

    but, i DO indeed also talk to Buddy, especially if i see him starting to get afraid of "something" in the woods. He does hallucinate, i swear...acting all freaked out about nothing there...
    i sure do talk to HIM, usually laughing, saying "the monsters are all gone tonight, Bud, all gone. they musta seen you coming..."

    He does know "all gone"...yeap, he does know what "all gone" means, for of the few words he seems to be able to generalize from one item/sitation, to another...
  11. tx_cowgirl Honored Member

    I think talking to yourself, your dog, or another person helps the HANDLER a lot. Gives you something to focus on other than, "OH MY GOSH WHAT IS MY DOG ABOUT TO DO????"
    Congrats to all with your achievements. ^^ Pat-on-the-backs to both of you!
    tigerlily46514 likes this.
  12. reveuse Well-Known Member

    I agree ... WTG Z!!!!

    Our boys are all such sillys!
    tigerlily46514 likes this.
  13. reveuse Well-Known Member

    Been having a super duper successful week and then BAM , cujo decided to strike with absolutely ZERO warning this afternoon...and it wasnt even a man ......
    Was literally DUMBFOUNDED.

    this must be his secret not so stealthy payback for the fact that i've been seriously researching on petfinder / rescue type places for a girl that meets my HEFTY nearly impossible list if requirements (which will take ages to find ANYWAYS)....... seriously Ro... *sigh*
  14. srdogtrainer Experienced Member

    Aww that's too bad. I was reading through the thread sooooo excited to hear how wonderfully your dog is doing, getting over his fears. Then I got to your last post and that is just heart breaking. I too have a stranger fearing dog and I've been through the ups and downs. A few really good experiences and I am all ready to say oh great it was just a stage and now he's over it...then of course there is another incident! : (

    I agree that it can be annoying trying to get people to understand and be courteous to your dogs needs. People just don’t get it. They see a dog and go, oh I would get benefit out of saying high to that dog and they don’t see the negative impact just one negative experience can effect a dogs life. But once they have had one negative experience it is like a domino effect that is really hard to end!

    Young kids are the worst, because they just wont listen and I have had times where I am spinning in a circle (with my dog hiding behind me) trying to keep them a way.

    I have found that what usually works for my individual dog (assuming people are cooperative) is not letting them come up to my dog. Instead I Hold him back until he has made the decision to go up and then I wait a little longer and then let him go say hi. It probably won’t work for all dogs, but over time try to figure out what is working. For example River does well when people are sitting in a chair, but he does not like when they are squatting or sitting on the floor (weird I know). He likes to go up to people but he hates when they come up to him, especially when they (mainly kids) are running up to him. He does not like people reaching out to pet him unless he has already rubbed his head against them. He is fine once people have started petting him.,,like when a kid came up to him so fast while he was scratching and he did not even notice until they had started petting him. I think River decides that if they are already petting him and have not hurt him yet or he has not had the opportunity to worry then they must be okay. When people are ignoring him totally and just having a conversation with me River seems to get annoyed that life is not all about him so he wants to change that. He does best when people have an agenda not concerning him and he wants to make sure they know he is there and in need of petting. Once he has decided that someone is scary though it is rare he will change his mind. On the rare occurrences that he has changed his mind, it has taken up to a half hour for him to decide that someone is okay, but most people are not willing to stay around that long…most people just cause damage and leave. :(
  15. snooks Experienced Member

    Please don't let one Cujo get you down. We all have off days/bad hair days/sleepless nights. Sorry to contribute further to the hijack. I promise to redeem myself momentarily. Tigerlily as recall I joined in 2008-you came after I did and had a pretty darn good grasp on the situation with Buddy when I had to take leave in mid 2009. So less than a year. Give urself some well deserved pats on the back. [IMG]

    Jackienmutts that posts here had a super dog aggressivie GSD fem. that is now walking on leash on the beach and down her street with J and the other dog (a once upon a time dog she redirected on). I've seen part of this transformation after moving to Ca. Amazing. In less about 2 years J has come a million miles. This last week her fem. had a moment of clarity - oh maybe I can meet this dog-my former trigger. She came closer and made miles of progress. J was wise enough to pull her back wanting more and realize all doesn't have to be cured today--so they left with her wanting more after a moment of pause. All of that deserves to be managed and enjoyed not pondered for the moment of pause. The million miles walked to get within touching distance was the war that was won and to be celebrated--the skirmishes can wait and be won another day. This is not a return to zero but part of a process of a dynamic thinking being.

    Have heart Revuse you've crossed the ocean and emerged on the beach. Perspective. [IMG] This is awesome work and I am impressed that you are all taking the time and love to do it. Too many people do not.

    J has helped me further rehab my poofy werewolf (fear barking golden - fierce grrr NOT) nobody is scared of a growly golden unf for her. So the masses descended to pet her anyway. EEK! GRR! She is now after 6 mos of being here dragging J (when J walks her) up to yard crews, neighbors, mailmen, (not yet the evil UPS driver). She's turned into a pet seeking missle. She's been recovering from a huge fear trauma after I moved in dec 2007. She was 99% back after a little over a year after a total shutdown hide in the basement spook fest. I moved again in sept 2010 and she made the transition beautifully.

    My lucky number came up for a service dog puppy right at the beginning of all the freakout and the puppy helped keep her and me sane. SRDT that's where there the puppy lust you speak of weaves itself in. I look at my service dog puppy (now adult) tonight lying in my bed on her back snoring (but very cutely) I secretly smile when she does it and I never mind when she wakes me up because there's no malice or manners involved. Puppy fix. Just the bliss of being dog and being guileless enough to feel safe and unabashed sleeping on your back stretched out for the world to see or rub ur belly. I slept like that last when I was 4-5 years old. The sleep of the innocent.

    I remember in the endless days of fear and distraction and refocus and redirect and reward. Teaching relaxation and blinking and no sleep because I could not leave the puppy unattended. I had a crate but sleeping all day does not train puppies. I see her now and know that she'll get up if I drop the remote or my bottle of water off the bed that she will eagerly hop up to retrieve it and crawl up in my lap and put it in my hands. Do i miss the pup she was? forever. Do I revel in the glorious adult she is? every moment.

    I look over at the former poofy WW as she sighs and settles in after they both went out in the rain by THEMSELVES to potty and came right back inside without an escort. I taught the PWW to blink to mimic relaxing postures and now she batts her eyelashes at all the men she meets. Glorious success PS missle. I still say my prayers and am thankful they are no longer puppies that awake howling twice a night to go out, then make me stand in the snow while they grunt out product.

    I offer the heavens money for video of puppy blazing around the corner with the end of the toilet paper in her mouth and the roll unfurling like old glory behind her in great billowing waves. She executed a perfect somersault and grabbed the middle of the settling cloud and shredded it into 1000's of bits before I could remove my hand from my mouth, where I had clapped it to prevent myself from laughing and encouraging the little tasmanian devil, to say eh-EH! She now can pick up paper without getting it spitty if I use the "pick" cue and my sunglasses are safe.

    I have a yearning to foster some senior dogs for the next challenge because I sense they need me more or maybe I understand them better as I get older. They are like puppies again somehow but they move a heck of a lot slower and they are much more content to sit and be amused at everyone else's antics as I am! Much mirth.

    Good training on all fronts here. Fear issues depending on their nature 6 mos-2 years for severe cases and unf some are life endeavors. The important part is that there is life-and it is happy, healthy, and rich. They don't know they can't go to the dog park etc. Not all are destined to do so but they can be and are as content with the right activity and training. I don't consider a few months/years a long time percentage wise. An average human in therapy needs about as long to work things out.
    PWW has a likely hereditary component so it's a life thing though that doesn't have to be anything but a joy if you are educated (as obv you all are) and manage with love (again as you all are). Some part of us must continue for the life of some dogs to take that little extra second to help when they stumble and party and cry with joy when they succeed beyond our dreams. Luckily we love them madly enough to do so.
  16. sara Moderator

    Awe Snooks! that's an awesome post! So heartwarming! You write very beautifully.

    I also have trouble with a fear reactive dog, he's stranger reactive and dog reactive. Alot of the people problems were caused by me (imo) and we're now working together (using "Click to Calm" techniques. We also had a bit of a breakthrough this weekend. Oliver met my Sister's fiance (they came to visit from Ontario) and Oliver never once snapped at him... but I watched them like a hawk. Telling the Fiance when to take off the pressure (back away) how to play with him, what not to do, and so on. He also never submissive pee'd once in the entire weekend (a HUGE WOO HOO)

    Hopefully he'll continue in this manner, and hopefully everyone else I choose to introduce him to will follow instructions as well as Jamie did this weekend. :)
    Jean likes this.
  17. tx_cowgirl Honored Member


    Better yet, have Jackie hug you for me. :D So so happy to see you here again. In a couple years I'll be headed to California for school; we can all be training buddies. :D

    Great, great post, as always. Hope you, Chizzie, and Kimber are all doing well in Cali.
    Jean likes this.
  18. srdogtrainer Experienced Member

    California??? Which school? BUCS?

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