About some Dog Shows

Discussion in 'Off-Topic & Chit Chat' started by landseer, Jan 27, 2008.

  1. landseer Well-Known Member

    Hello my friends. Let me thank you all for the things and the experiences you share every time in this wonderful Academy.
    Today I would like to share with you an experience of mine occured last September at a Dog Show near my town. I had been invited at this Dog Show by the breeder who sold me Chantal. He wanted to see how she grew up and what she looked like. Well, I went there and, from the beginning I realized my first certitude. My dog would have never passed through the torture and humiliation of a Dog Show. It was like going at a museum, all those dogs on tables with their owners brushing, spraying, and so on. Or into cages. Some of them after their grooming weren't allow to sit or lay because otherwise it should have been done all again. Chantal and all the other dogs who were there as visitors were much more alive and received much more attention than the ones which participated at the show. Anyway, the worst had to happen. While I was taking Chantal to have some water one of the judges stopped us asking me if she could see for a while Chantal. At the beginning I didn't know what to do as I felt so astonished. Then I began to get upset. The judge was finding all the negative things in my dog: the not perfect position at the base of her tail, too many black dots on the white part, my chantal was not as big as her newfie and all her bla bla bla. She ended her checking by a useless hint to me:" You should wait before letting your dog particiapte to a dog show. It wouldn't be rewarding for you to be told 'What a disgusting dog'!" My patience was going to flash red and before exploding in a rude way I took a breath and told this judge " You know Madam, my dog is not meant for a Dog Show. She has a much more noble task: she will work in Pet Therapy where a dog is a wonderful mate and friend apart from spots or not perfect tails. Perhaps your daughter should be left in a closet only because she's not Miss Universe?". I shook her hand and went away so very proud of my Chantal.
    Till next time my friends and thanks for your attention!
    Mario and Chantal.

  2. marieke New Member

    Yay Mario!! Well said. I don't like them dog shows either. What does it matter what a dog looks like? Most of the times it is the "flaws" in their exterior that make them look unique.

    ps: I think Chantal looks gorgeous!
  3. lagomorphmonster New Member

    I just looked at Chantal's pictures, and she is beautiful!
  4. storm22 Experienced Member

    well done for speaking your mind Mario,
    ive had similar situations with storm i took him along to a breed show (for the experience of seeing different things for him) and a cattle dog breeder walked up to me and told me what she thinks of my pup, he was about 5-7months (an ugly stage) and she said he was too skinny and didnt fit the breed standard and he was an inbreed and definatly not from her dogs.
    i simply told her no he wasnt from her dogs as he wasnt overweight and he had good muscle structure, and as for inbreeding probably i got him off a farm in the back blocks.

    any hoo a few years later (when he had filled out and looked like a dog not a monster from the abiss) we went again, and she bought some people over to tell them that this must be one of her breeding progeny as he was 'a fine specimen' (her words), and i quickly informed her that two years ago she told me he wasnt hers and he was an inbreed, well she hasnt spoken to me since as i embarresed her in front of potential buyers

    but it just goes to show you, you never judge a book (or dog) by its cover, it adds value the more you let it mature
  5. landseer Well-Known Member

    Hello my dear friends!
    Me and Chantal want to thank marieke, lagomorphmonster and storm22 for their agreements and compliments for my baby. We really appreciate this and especially appreciate that it's not right to judge a book (or dog) by its cover and that it adds value the more you let it mature. Infact a dog should be valued for everything he/she gives you every day. And we are so sure that every dog is a powerful creature. Thank you so much friends!
    Mario and Chantal.
  6. alix New Member

    Chantal is a cutie, a lovely baby and you should not listen to anyone, we fall in love with our pets the way they are, and for us they are perfect :grrrrrr:
    My last girl who was a scottie, her ears never stood up straight the way it sould, and I was suggested to operate and put in wires :msncry: NO WAY, so be it if my girl looked like a schnawser more than a scottie, she was cute the way she was period.
    Now I have a delemma. I got a new girl, she is lovely, far from being perfect for showing, even though her line is pure. 1 month ago, I got her brother from the breeder for free, with the condition that she will show him, since he is more perfect than his father who is a champion. I agreed because I fell in love with him, and the law was not allowing my breeder to keep both him and the dad. I am having many concerns about showing him. Sure, I would be proud once he becomes a champion, but then that means I cannot neuter him, and twice a year he will be gone for few weeks to do his Manly duties and that breaks my heart. Now reading your post also made me sad, I wish I could back off of this whole thing :dogsad:
  7. emmasmamma Guest

    Here! Here! Mario. No animal is perfect and they don't have to meet "show standards" to give a heartful of love or warm your heart!
  8. l_l_a New Member

    Landseer your dog is lovely!! Don't let no mean judge say anything otherwise!!

    I'm not interested in conformation shows - I have friends who do that with their dogs (I've helped them manage their dogs and stuff at dog shows) but to me it is a separate world unto itself that doesn't appeal to me. I think it's really only 'useful' for breeders because they are the ones who are charged with the responsibility of maintaining and improving the health and vitality of their chosen breed. So the conformation shows are just one way to judge one aspect of the 'quality' of their breeding lines. I don't think the dogs necessarily hate it though, certainly they are trained since puppyhood to be used to the show atmosphere so it doesn't bother them to be poked and prodded and primped up.

    The first time I attended a conformation show was to lend moral support to a friend who was showing her miniature poodle. When I arrived I saw her and her dog waiting outside their ring for their turn. Instinctively I went over and greeted the dog by petting him on the head. My friend, in a huff, immediately took out a comb and started re-fluffing his head and ears, I realized woops, I guess I should keep my hands to myself here, hehe!! I found it soo hard to not pet the cute doggies but somehow I managed!

    well my dog would never do well in conformation anyway - he's neutered! Also, white german shepherds are disqualified anyway.
  9. l_l_a New Member

    Alix why wasn't your breeder allowed to keep both the dog and his father?
  10. tx_cowgirl Honored Member

    Well said!!!! I would have been absolutely furious. To be completely honest, I haven't yet learned about conformation. I don't know a dern thing about dog conformation. I do know about horse conformation, show steer, lamb, and pig conformation, and even a little about llamas! Haha. But somehow, I haven't yet learned about dogs. Your Chantal is gorgeous, so that judge can just stick it in her...erm...ear. Yes, her ear.
    Some of the best herding dogs I've seen didn't have the best conformation. Some of the best agility dogs didn't have the best conformation. Mud's one of the most fantastic dogs I've ever trained, and I'm sure her conformation is probably nothing compared to a show border collie. Zeke is a spectacular herding, obedience, agility, flyball, and frisbee dog, and would be awesome at anything he was trained in. He's a halfbreed. He has the enthusiasm, heart, and desire to work to do anything you teach him, and he is never lazy about what you ask him to do. However, stick him in a show ring and I'm sure the judges would probably laugh at him. I don't care. A show dog snuggles the same as a mutt! Lol. My friend got a female Rough Collie from a show breeder, and the breeder CUT HER EARS OFF so that my friend couldn't show her. For one, my friend wasn't planning on showing her anyway, but why the hell would you do that to a living being of any kind? I was furious, as was my friend. Hannah(the Collie) now has hearing problems, and of course she's a bit of an odd sight. But, she's a sweetheart, and gorgeous. She's an excellent dog.
    It's people like the rude judges, the ear-cutters, and the like that put a bad taste in my mouth for showing. My dogs are everything that I could possibly ask for, and anyone who says any less of them can keep their opinion to themselves, because I don't give a rat's tail what they think.
    Phew. My apologies, dears. Got a little worked up there. :dogblush: Lol.
  11. alix New Member

    to l-l-a, my breeder put in a request to get a permission to keep Sunny, and she was refused, the only way would have been to neuter the Dad, which is a shame for a 3 year old champion, or, to sell him, which she could not do because she treats him as her pet. I am not sure if the laws are the same everywhere, but in Germany they seem very strict to avoid puppy mills I guess. She has 7 females and 1 male, and a second male is refused so that there is no prodcution. She is allowed to breed twice a year, sometimes she might get permission for a third one. I am not sure though if it is for all breeds.
  12. storm22 Experienced Member

    i dont like some shows where (what ive actually seen) in a german shepherd class for instance (dogs prone to hip dysplasia) you see them running round the ring clearly showing signs of the disease yet the judge will pick that dog because of its colour or something and you can see the dog cant stand properly, that kind of turned me off the whole sport of breed shows as they dont even listen to the standard in most classes and those dogs will in future be breeding dogs as they have won champions and stuff passing the bad genes onwards.

    also i couldnt believe what i read from you tx_cowgirl in how a breeder would mutiliate her own dogs so you couldnt show them, thats disgusting, i know my sister bought luka (pug) from a breeder and they asked her the same question (are you going to show him) and she said no so they got her to sign a contract that she couldnt breed show him (agility was fine, he still has to learn lots, we've learnt pugs arent that smart lolz) and she had to castrate him within a year or they could take him off her, which was fair enough really as she was going to castrate him and he does come from top bloodlines in new zealand and australia so there just making sure there dogs arent puppymilled and his blood line isnt inbreed
    but they are really nice people who she still keeps in touch with and sends photos of his progress and she gets details of what his brothers and sisters are up to
  13. yoyopoodle Well-Known Member

    I'm so sorry you had an awful experience - the judge (and the cattle dog breeder) were both out of line... their opinions were not asked for, so they had no right to start lecturing on your dogs' 'imperfections'. If they had something nice to say it would have been fine, but breeders and judges tend to be very critical people...

    I used to show Charlie, though the hair style (and maintenance!!!) requirements for Poodles are ridiculous, and since he is a different style than what usually wins I was wasting my money... though I was told he'd finish quickly with a well-known handler - not only does that feel like I am 'buying' a championship rather than 'earning' it, my whole goal was to have fun with my dog, not send him away with someone else!

    Conformation (ear set, tail carriage, color...) isn't very important in my mind, but structure is vital. In many breeds only dogs with good conformation AND structure win, so in those cases I believe shows are a good thing - most of the people who show don't have the time/interest in performance events to accurately decide which dogs are 'sound'.
    However, not all breeds are like that... especially the long/fluffy-haired dogs. In those breeds, quite a few judges seem to go for the outline, rather than where the bones are actually located.
    Poodles are one of the worst breeds in that context - most have awful over-angulated rears, and most have weak straight fronts, almost all with ewe necks... many types of 'work' are hard/painful, or just impossible, and the joints break down long before old age.
    Other than a ewe neck, Charlie has decent front and back structure, especially considering his breed - but he could never win in AKC because he looks 'different'. In other clubs that favor a dog who can also work, he has never been beaten by a Poodle, and has placed/won the group many times! And they allow other haircuts too - one of the clubs would even let me show him completely shaved, lol. Though I must say, the elaborate grooming is something that Charlie absolutely loved! All that special attention just for him, and the whole city knew him by name - he spent a few days being depressed when I cut it off!!!

    I hope (if you ever get up the nerve again, lol), that you will have a better experience at another show. Hang-out at the rally ring and you'll find other therapy dogs - and people who do obedience and agility will also be friendly... they know that it's the temperament that matters :)
  14. amanda85 Guest

    i've only been to ONCE of these 'beauty pageant' show....and that was because it was being held at the same location n same day as another dog sport that i was participating...

    so both me n my dog went over the dog show ring and have a peek....and it was definately 'eye opening' for me to see how different the way their dog behaves...

    my dog was so hyperactive that she barks when i walk away from her a little.... but their dogs can stand on the table for an hour!!

    for me, dog with drive and speed is much more fun in the family than a dog that just look beautiful... infact, beauty lies in the eye of beholder

    n due to the inbred problems n selected gene pool among the show dogs....they tends to plaque with genetic problems...

    in the ppl i know...they even rehome the veteran show dogs...
  15. luna may New Member

    I'm sorry, my computer died while I was writing my reply and it got erased. I re-wrote it somehow, here:

    Way to go landseer, you were great! I think we're all proud of how you handled the situation, so good for you! :good:

    *Yes, I totally agree- I'm opposed to racism of any kind, and as it's downright stupid and horrible to do it to humans, there is no reason to do it to our dogs! Every living creature is judged by it's personality, as far as I'm concerned.
    **That's what happened to Kesem, only that they (illegaly, we discovered later by means of our furious vet) chopped off her tail, right down to the bone. Not a millimeter of flesh left. Of coure the skin grew back, and she's OK, but there's no fur in that part of her tail. :dogsad:
    ***Thank goodness, Kesem doesn't suffer from any side effects (exept, of course, looking pretty wierd without a tail). We let the fur grow around the tail base in a kind of tuffty ponpon, so that it looks like a little flower, but at least she has something to wag. She seems to be getting around OK with other dogs, but we have to rely a lot on her ears and head to understand her expresions- exept happieness, when the tail-fur moves around so fast it's just a fuzzy blur :dogsmile:.
    Thanks god, at least our case ended fine (relatively, in comparision with other cases we "Iatsanu Bezol"- 'got out of it cheap'- much better than you would think we would, as we say here ;)).
    I sencierly and truly hope that such things will never happen again, at least as long as I can help it.
  16. tx_cowgirl Honored Member

    Aw, poor Kesem! Grr, people like that just make me want to....do things that shouldn't be repeated. :dogmad: Rusty's part Rottie, and he has a natural stub tail. He doesn't have much of a tail, but it doesn't matter anyway...it's easy to tell when he's happy because his whole rear end wags. :doglaugh: It's good that Kesem doesn't have any serious side effects. Agreed...racism is wrong on all levels.
  17. bipa New Member

    Hmmm, I lived for a while not too far away from Rottweil in Germany, where the Rottweiler dog originated. They actually have normal long tails if they aren't docked. Since docking has become illegal here in Germany, you're finally seeing more Rotties with their full tails. So are you saying that for some genetic reason Rusty's tail is a stub, or was it cut? Just curious, since it doesn't really make a big difference for Rusty at this point. :dogsmile:

    Rotties make wonderful family pets and are great with children. They've gotten a really bad rap in North America where they've often been improperly bred to increase aggression. The Rotties I've met here in Germany are much more laid back and relaxed.


  18. daniii New Member

    I just wanted to say something about Rottweilers...

    German Rotties are just SO different from the ones I've seen here. A lot of people keep them as guard dogs and they are really...dangerous. But I once met a German Rottie a breeder had when I was looking for a new dog. We went to her house, and the rottie was really sweet...she even barked less than the other dogs! Her temperament was completely different from what I had seen before. I asked, and the answer was something like:"I got her in Germany, where the real rotties are".
    Those are the rotties that actually live for the purpose they where first bred for: family pets. It's a shame they have such a bad "fame" in America...They can be really awesome dogs. It makes me sad to know it's actually people's fault the breed is like that....
  19. tx_cowgirl Honored Member

    Rusty's got some pit, some Rottie, and I don't have a clue what else. When I got him, he came from a family friend who found him wandering in a field. His tail is natural, not docked, as far as I can tell.
    Hmm, that second pic looks quite different from the American-bred Rotties. All the ones I've seen here don't have quite as loose, droopy jowls and facial features. Rusty's got the Rottie head, big, thick chest, and big neck. However, he has the size of a Pit Bull, and some other features of the pit. With the two combined breeds, he's very muscular for his size. Most of it is in his front end though, as his hind end is much less muscular. He almost looks like a mini-Rott, in build at least. Lol. He's brindle though.
    My uncle had a Rottie when I was very young(maybe 4-6 years old) and I loved him. I would sit on him and try to ride him like a horse, snuggle with him, nap on him; you name it, that poor dog tolerated it. ^^ He was a big old sweetheart.
    Rotties were originally bred as stock and guard dogs. I've seen these qualities in Rusty, and he actually has some qualities of a good stock dog. Show lambs have to be exercised, which is best with a dog. So, I started out using him. He's no border collie by any means, but he had enough instinct that I taught him how to run my lambs. I set up three jumps, and he quickly learned the pattern I wanted him to run the lambs in. If they broke it, he would herd them back into place and continue in the pattern. When I called him, he would leave the lambs and come to me, and he knew his job was done. Of course, this is by far nothing close to actual herding work, but he surprised me with how well he did. I still use him to run the lambs, and he does a great job. He's laid-back enough that he doesn't just immediately try to run them. When I first get the lambs, they of course aren't used to dogs. If I let Zeke loose with them immediately, they'd probably go crazy with fear and try to jump through a wall. Rusty stays calm when I first introduce him to the new lambs, and with his patience they learn to respect him and respond to his cues. He is not aggressive by any means, but lambs are prey animals and naturally are a little apprehensive towards dogs. After a while they actually become buddies with him. ^^ When they're not running, they'll actually snuggle with him sometimes. He's got a lot of traditional Rottie qualities, which I love. There were a few occasions that he got out(he's a canine Houdini) and snuggled up to my 1200-pound steer. He likes to give kisses to my horses. He's an excellent guard dog. If he's barking, there's a good reason for it. When my most recent filly was born, he layed where he could see her and her mother and stayed completely quiet. It was sweet...kind of like a little surrogette mother. Lol. For the longest time he kept a close eye on her, and if he thought something was wrong or she was doing something she shouldn't(which was often, because she's a troublemaker), he would let me know. He's a sweetie.
    Wow. :dogblink: Sorry, kind of rambled there. xD
  20. storm22 Experienced Member

    i had a rotti x lab when i was growing up too tx_cowgirl and he sounded like your rusty thats why we looked at koda as shes rotti x pit bull and she has her natural herding insincts aswell she likes to herd storm much to his dissagreement as he wants to herd too (poor luka gets it from both dogs lolz)

    but he was a sweet dog who i could ride (he was my mums dog and he was about 4yrs when i was moving round) but he taught me and my older sister to walk being there to catch us if we fall and watch the newborn lambs at my uncles when he had stray dogs coming to his property he was always calm and gentle and the ewes liked having him around just like another sheep, a few times my uncle used him at lambing as he was calm and if my uncle had sheep with problems, scruff would sound the alarm or if the ewe died he had bought about 10lambs to the house in his lifetime, but he was also my grandads bird dog, at duck hunting season he would go out with my grandad and retrieve the ducks for him (his lab breeding), he was a dog of many talents in his 11year lifetime sadly he died doing what he loved being out in the feild ducking hunting, he went for a swim after bringing the duck back and dived in the water but sadly didnt come back up, my grandad had to go in after him and buried him up watching over the lake he loved soo much.

    so when we heard of koda and her breeding we knew she'll be the next dog we get, shes quite laid back and has alot of rotti traits even though she looks pitty (but she does have pitty traits too which i like)

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